Peter Stefanovic: Tim it's good to see you. Now you were the first to lean into the cut to the fuel excise here on this program many weeks ago. Then it was knocked back by the Treasurer, who's had a U-turn. So it's now past the Senate. Are you marking that as a win?

Tim Wilson MP: Well, we're marking it as a partial win because of course, yes, the Treasurer has been overruled by the Prime Minister again but the real issue is that we don't have inflationary offsets. When we put forward a final proposal to be adopted it included inflationary offsets so that when you did this it wouldn't stoke inflation. I think we have to start to prepare for a budget where it's quite clear that Jim Chalmers is going to continue to stoke inflation and going to put upward pressure on interest rates and that is a critical and essential thing that Australia just doesn't need right now and Australians don't really need right now.

Peter Stefanovic: I'm sure we'll get to that in a moment but just back onto the fuel excise, haven't you failed to heed the lessons of the past, short-term band-aids create longer-term problems?

Tim Wilson MP: That's precisely why when we put forward a proposal we didn't do so until we had inflation offsets. That looked at how we were making sure it wasn't going to stoke the nature of the problem. The Government has completely ignored that advice from the Opposition, from economists, from everybody, because that's what they're seeking to do. That's why it's a partial victory because we got the relief that households need right now but what we didn't get was offsets that would address the problem of inflation and so the next time interest rates go up, it's like the Government is daring the Reserve Bank to increase interest rates even further.

Peter Stefanovic: Westpac now believes there could be as many as three more rate rises this year. That's the fuel excise cut already swallowed up and then some isn't it?

Tim Wilson MP: Well absolutely it is when you look at households with mortgages. And what we know is that the Government is going to continue to stoke inflation with continuing to borrow from the future and spending today. That's why it's essential that the Government gets inflation under control in this budget. But all signs say that they think they know better. Just remember, last March, this time last year, Jim Chalmers said we've turned the corner on inflation and interest rates. Well we have turned a corner but the trajectory is up.

Peter Stefanovic: Where would you be making cuts?

Tim Wilson MP: I said consistently that we need to be addressing the root cause of fraud and corruption. I said this last night in parliament whether it's public money going to organised crime through the CFMEU Labor cartel addressing NDIS corruption, which is estimated to be 10 per cent of the total budget, though most people think that's probably a conservative estimate. There's been reports of $400 million that's gone towards fraud in child care. There's reports only last weekend about age care and similar issues of fraud there. Until the government starts to take corruption seriously and fraud seriously they can't turn around to Australians and say we're going to add more taxes when it's just going to go and fund organised crime, corruption and fraud.

Peter Stefanovic: If we're getting into three rate rises this year, and that's at the extreme end, not all banks are considering that by the way, how does that marry with your own thoughts and expectations when it comes to rate rises this year?

Tim Wilson MP: Well I mean I'm always cautious because I don't want Australians being punished for the Government's failure to manage inflation. I want Australian households to be secure, confident and looking to the future. But under this Government, that doesn't seem like it's likely and Australian households are going to pay the price of a Government and a Treasurer who has lost control of his Budget. The question, I think, for every Australian is whether they eventually are going to see a change because the only way we're going to see a change is if there's a change of government. The biggest question is going to be when the Treasurers is actively running the Australian economy down and I say this with absolute sadness, you've got record small business insolvencies, what are we going to have that's left that we're going to be able to build from?

Peter Stefanovic: Okay, that's the Shadow Treasurer, Tim Wilson.

ENDS