Michael McLaren:  Tim Wilson is the Shadow Treasurer I wanted to get his take he's on the line. Tim, good afternoon.

Tim Wilson MP: Good afternoon Michael.

Michael McLaren: Jeez, over prepared. I don't think too many people would be throwing that one around at the moment?

Tim Wilson MP: Well, I was sitting in the House of Representatives a few weeks ago and I watched Chris Bowen say, there's no problem. You're all being hysterical and raising concerns about the access to fuel. Within three days, he declared a national crisis. This government has been caught on the hop at every step, flat-footed, and they don't have a plan going forward.

Michael McLaren: I think the line's okay, we'll just come back. So, I've got you now. Yep, okay, so no plan. The opposition's plan is to halve the fuel excise. This won't be the sum total of the opposition's approach, but the headline story today, some of the economists have already said, well, yeah, okay we get it, but it could add to inflation. That means the likelihood of an interest rate going up, okay, it's going to be higher. What you save in fuel excise will be gobbled up with extra repayments, so on and so forth, you take from Peter, you rob Paul, whatever the analogy is. There are always risks, economic risks with halving excise, are there?

Tim Wilson MP: There would be if we weren't offering offsets in terms of savings. We deliberately designed this plan where we would have offset in savings through things like FBT on EVs and removing that which the government seems to be looking at doing anyway. Looking at containing the battery scheme which has got out of control under Chris Bowen and we've deliberately put offsets so that it won't be inflationary because that's central to making sure that we don't just give something in one moment and then end up being collected on Australians elsewhere.

Michael McLaren: OK, just on that, you did the rather remarkable at the last election, you took a seat off a sitting teal and there's a lot of people in your electorate that are in favour of climate change action, renewable electricity, EVs, they might have a novated lease. How do you think the idea of halving fuel excise will go with some of your voters if it comes at the expense of some of these pro-climate policies or the government subsidies of them?

Tim Wilson MP: Well what we know is that while there's an important role for EVs as part of the system there needs to be a level playing field. The government's looking at EV charges right now for that reason. The politics of this needs to come secondary to what is it that Australians are living right now and what they're living is real economic pain. They go to the supermarket and putting items back on the shelf. They're going to the petrol station and they're to be able to afford it. So we need to be supporting Australians to be to afford basic costs of living, whether they're ferrying their kids around Saturday sport or in the lead up to Easter and holidays, as much as it is rural and regional communities where they have no choices.

Michael McLaren: Ok, Liberals, your side, you particularly, very pro-free market, but when you see the retail margin for diesel in some cases be 40, 45 cents per litre, as is evidence in a number of places at the moment, is there not an argument that the free market is not working in the best interests of Australian motorists, let alone the economy?

Tim Wilson MP: Well, businesses have costs, and if you want to get costs down, you've got to stop stoking inflation because small businesses, family businesses, are feeling real costs right now and are seeing massive cost inflation on them, and that's been followed through with the costs that they're experiencing and having to charge motorists. The best way to stop this problem is to stop Jim Chalmers' active inflation agenda, which is driving up these costs for businesses.

Michael McLaren: Yeah, sure. Okay, I appreciate that. I agree with that. But equally, profit margins, or margins, which include profit, may not necessarily have anything to do with inflation. That's just set by the retailer after they pay the wholesale freight. So, if, I did some numbers just yesterday, I mean, unleaded in this city, the margin's around 12 and a bit cents a litre. I don't think too many people would say that's daylight robbery. But in some cases, diesel's well north of 40 cents a litre. Obvious disparity there, it's almost double in some cases, so compared to unleaded, people would say, well hang on, that doesn't quite seem right, and yet the ACCC have no power to rein that in. I know yesterday Labor put through some legislation, the Liberals backed it, I understand why, but doubling the fines and the like, but you can find them a gazillion trillion dollars, but if the law does nothing to prevent price gouging which it does not, then it doesn't matter what the fine is, right?

Tim Wilson MP: Well, but the law does give the power for the ACCC in these circumstances to make sure that people aren't extracting excessive profits and taking advantage of the situation. The price that's ultimately set by the market, but when you see an exorbitant increase in cost of fuel profits. If that's occurring, then the ACCC does have the capacity to be able to look in and say are people being gouged, they have that power to look into that under the Competition and Consumer Act. That's one of the reasons why we supported the amendments yesterday in the Parliament is because we don't want Australians to be taken advantage of at this vulnerable and difficult time.

Michael McLaren: When was the last time the ACCC had a successful prosecution for price gouging the petrol industry?

Tim Wilson MP: Well, I don't have an answer to when they did that, but this is the burden, the expectation we now have on the ACCC. They've been given the power, they needed to do it on behalf of the Australian people, because Australians need to make sure that they're in a position not to be taken advantage of, that in a difficult crisis that people aren't gouging, because prices have to be reasonable and affordable, but we need to do that through competition too.

Michael McLaren: Just quickly, price gouging is illegal in Australia, not collusion, but price gouging?

Tim Wilson MP: Under the code that exists in the Competition and Consumer Act, there are limitations, but how it's interpreted is, you know, it's a matter for the ACCC, so we've got to make sure that they're using the powers that are available to them to make sure that consumers are not being taken advantage of.

Michael McLaren: I appreciate your time. If we don't speak beforehand, have a wonderful Easter. You too. Have a lovely Easter. Thank you, Tim. Tim Wilson there, the Shadow Treasurer.