Thursday 14 August 2025



E&OE

Mark Levy:

I thought we'd catch up with the Shadow Minister for Small Business, IR and Employment, Tim Wilson. He joins me on the line right now. Tim, good morning to you.

Tim Wilson:

Good morning, Mark.

Mark Levy:

Firstly, congratulations on winning back your seat. It's the first time we've had a chance to speak since the election, and you've floated an interesting thought process behind this move by the ACTU to reduce the workweek to four days. Run me through your thoughts.

Tim Wilson:

Well, I mean, they're taking a lend. Let's face it, you know, four days work week means that it'd be almost impossible for small business to turn a profit. It's hard enough as it is. It's very clear to me that, you now, the ACTU puts these proposals out there precisely so the government can slap them down. They do so, so then the Treasurer can walk out of these tax summits, these tax hike summits and say, oh, you we listened to business, we didn't give them everything they wanted, we listened to the unions, we didn't give them everything they wanted, we're charting a middle course and make them look reasonable. The ACTU knew this wasn't going to get up, they knew they're floating something out there into the ether, and it works for the government and it works for them because they seem to be fighting for their members but they're not actually delivering.

Mark Levy:

Well, that's the thing, isn't it Tim? I mean, it's that ridiculous, it can't be taken seriously. I mean all of the evidence, even the Treasurer himself says we're facing a productivity crisis. The numbers were made clear off the back of an RBA board decision the other day, and what the ACTU seriously thinks the way in which we fix this is to have a shorter work week. It makes no sense whatsoever.

Tim Wilson:

The real problem is we need to lift standards of living in this country. People have been going backwards. Costs are going up far faster than we're seeing wages go up. So Australians are going backwards, we might have seen a little reduction in interest rates, of course that might help at the margins, but it's nothing in comparison to what we're seeing with our electricity bills, our insurances, everything else that's going up and people are feeling the pinch. So until you get downward pressure on costs, which is ultimately the reflection of things like productivity, you're not actually going to see people's standards of living improve and it's going to be harder for people to get ahead. They're working harder, they're not getting ahead under this government.

Mark Levy:

Is this just going to be a talkfest next week, Tim? Is there any genuine reform going to come out of it, do you think?

Tim Wilson: 

It's hard to know anymore, because it started out as a productivity summit, then by the Prime Minister, then the Treasurer's Tax Hike Summit, he floated increasing the GST, then the Prime Minister slapped him down, then it became a productivity summit again, then it became about the four-day work week. Nobody knows, including the government, what it's about. Now they're going to have multiples of them. This is the problem. And the ultimate issue of productivity and improving standards of living is industrial relations laws, and the government has said that's not on the table. So if you want to improve standards of living in this country, you need to have a conversation about how we have partnerships between employers and employees to build the future strength of this country. Make it more successful, increase wages, and that's the one topic the government doesn't want on the table.

Mark Levy:

Is there anyone else from the coalition attending this roundtable aside from Ted O'Brien? And do you know if anyone's been invited to speak? I mean, is Ted O'Brien able to present to this roundtable or is he merely there as an observer?

Tim Wilson:

Ted O'Brien as the Shadow Treasurer, is attending the round table. My understanding is that he's primarily there as an observer, and of course to hear mostly what the other participants in the room are saying. But the government's actually excluded as well. One of the key voices we need in that room, which is the mining industry, the mining industry is the source of most of the economic growth in this country, that pays for all the essential services we need, like health and education. And they're not even being allowed into the room, such as the stitch up job that the government is trying to put forward.

Mark Levy:

I know you've got a strong opinion on most things Tim, I can't let you go without asking you about the Prime Minister's decision to recognise a Palestinian state, the fact that it's being applauded by the Hamas terrorists. Can you believe this? I just cannot wrap my head around the fact that we have a terrorist regime, celebrating a decision by an Australian Prime Minister. How does that sit with you?

Tim Wilson: 

Well if you don't want terrorist organisations to applaud a government decision perhaps you shouldn't do things that terrorist organisations want. The reality is, as soon as a terrorist organisation like Hamas, says that their objective is to have the recognition of a Palestinian state off the back of murdering civilians... which is what they've been doing consistently for many years now. The idea that governments would then cede to that and give in to that, is frankly madness. It's immoral, and they've incentivised attacks on Israeli and Palestinian civilians by a terrorist group.

Mark Levy:

Do you think he should retract the statement and the support for a Palestinian state, because I mean anybody out there now knowing that a terrorist regime is virtually applauding his decision, is it wrong for him to say, look, I've got it wrong, I'm stuffed up here, we can't be supporting a terrorist region?

Tim Wilson:

Well, he's actually literally set out conditions of his decision, certain things, like Hamas has no support in the Palestinian state, like they recognise the right of Israel. But when it’s been put to him, if they don't deliver on that, will he retract his support? And he hasn't said he will. I mean, he has written them a blank check. To write a blank check to essentially a terrorist organisation is one of the most insane political decisions I've ever seen of an Australian government. It's a reflection that he's running the Australian government like he's the president of a student council at a university, not the Prime Minister of the Commonwealth of Australia.

Mark Levy:

Well said, Tim, well said. Keep telling it how it is, mate. We need powerful voices like yours in Opposition to hold this government to account. Thanks for joining us.

Tim Wilson:

Thanks Mark, take care.

Mark Levy:

Tim Wilson, Shadow Minister for Small Business, IR and Employment.

ENDS